Bush's Place in History.

[DuncanONeil]

Well put. But don't just condemn the "liberal press"; include the conservative media (Rush, et al) in your statement.

It's time to stop being liberal or conservative, Republican or Democrat. It's time to start being Americans! Brothers and sisters united in defense of our country and our way of life. Find common ground in the middle of our belief systems and work from there. We are all seeking the same goals! Don't let corrupt politicians, over-paid industrialists, or loud-mouthed talk show hosts steal our heritage from us! Question everything, don't take anyone's word, search out the FACTS. Everyone in this forum (I presume) has a connection to the Internet. USE that to learn the truth, not just the propaganda.

Some of what you said bothers me a very basic level, but I will let that slide.
I have found a number of people across various forums that even when presented with factual information simply refuse to consider that information. How would you propose to get them to consider the information?

[Thorne]

I have found a number of people across various forums that even when presented with factual information simply refuse to consider that information. How would you propose to get them to consider the information?

That doesn't surprise me at all. As I said in an earlier post, "Except they are not undecided! They decided months, years, decades ago that they were Republicans or Democrats and they will fight tooth and nail against anyone who tries to gainsay them. Facts mean nothing, statistics mean nothing, legality or illegality mean nothing."

There is absolutely nothing you can do or say to change the minds of this type of fanatic. And they exist everywhere, in every political party, in every religion, in every country. There is always, and will always be, a certain type of person who knows beyond any doubt that his point of view is the only right one. Beating him over the head with the truth or with facts only makes him condemn you for your brutality. This is the kind of person who will don a white sheet and kidnap, torture and kill innocent people simply because of their color. This is the kind of person who will kill dozens of innocent people simply because they happen to work at an abortion clinic. This is the kind of person who flies planes loaded with civilians into buildings. Whether you label them as terrorists, fanatics, patriots or "dittoheads," their hatred and anger towards anything which opposes them marks them as ignorant and dangerous.

[wmrs2]

That doesn't surprise me at all. As I said in an earlier post, "Except they are not undecided! They decided months, years, decades ago that they were Republicans or Democrats and they will fight tooth and nail against anyone who tries to gainsay them. Facts mean nothing, statistics mean nothing, legality or illegality mean nothing."

There is absolutely nothing you can do or say to change the minds of this type of fanatic. And they exist everywhere, in every political party, in every religion, in every country. There is always, and will always be, a certain type of person who knows beyond any doubt that his point of view is the only right one. Beating him over the head with the truth or with facts only makes him condemn you for your brutality. This is the kind of person who will don a white sheet and kidnap, torture and kill innocent people simply because of their color. This is the kind of person who will kill dozens of innocent people simply because they happen to work at an abortion clinic. This is the kind of person who flies planes loaded with civilians into buildings. Whether you label them as terrorists, fanatics, patriots or "dittoheads," their hatred and anger towards anything which opposes them marks them as ignorant and dangerous.

Brother, I am glad that we are not like that. People who act like they know what they believe should be shot. I am glad to get that off my chest. That's what Rush does too when he points out dittoheads; he agrees with us. He does not tolerate people who think they know what they believe either.

[Thorne]

Brother, I am glad that we are not like that. People who act like they know what they believe should be shot. I am glad to get that off my chest. That's what Rush does too when he points out dittoheads; he agrees with us. He does not tolerate people who think they know what they believe either.

I didn't say that! I said that these people think their beliefs are the ONLY truth.

[wmrs2]

That doesn't surprise me at all. As I said in an earlier post, "Except they are not undecided! They decided months, years, decades ago that they were Republicans or Democrats and they will fight tooth and nail against anyone who tries to gainsay them. Facts mean nothing, statistics mean nothing, legality or illegality mean nothing."

There is absolutely nothing you can do or say to change the minds of this type of fanatic. And they exist everywhere, in every political party, in every religion, in every country. There is always, and will always be, a certain type of person who knows beyond any doubt that his point of view is the only right one. Beating him over the head with the truth or with facts only makes him condemn you for your brutality. This is the kind of person who will don a white sheet and kidnap, torture and kill innocent people simply because of their color. This is the kind of person who will kill dozens of innocent people simply because they happen to work at an abortion clinic. This is the kind of person who flies planes loaded with civilians into buildings. Whether you label them as terrorists, fanatics, patriots or "dittoheads," their hatred and anger towards anything which opposes them marks them as ignorant and dangerous.

Pardon me please but I just can not let this go. You don't really think that Rush would done a white sheet, kidnap, torture and kill innocent people do you? You are exaggerating to make a point, are you not? I don't see a mass of conservatives or liberals, who are firmly trenched in their beliefs flying plains into anything. It is just human nature, a carnal nature, to dislike people who disagree with us and I don,t like those people who are enlightened like us either. I just think God that I am not like other men. The thing that bothers me is that other men think God that I am not like them either. I am not going to get upset about it. What do those dumb bastards know anyway?

[Thorne]

Pardon me please but I just can not let this go. You don't really think that Rush would done a white sheet, kidnap, torture and kill innocent people do you?

No! Absolutely not! I was talking about some of the KINDS of people who will take every word that Rush, and others like him, says as gospel.

I haven't listened to him in years, but when I did I found him to be dangerously seductive. His "facts" always seemed self-evident, and his opinions sounded logical, especially when delivered in that enthusiastic, pompous rhetoric of his. But when I checked those "facts" independently (which is something I always felt he would not want me to do) I found them to be subtly different from what he claimed. He didn't lie, precisely. It wasn't blatant. But he always added that little twist, or neglected that one word or phrase, which seemed to change the meaning of what he was ranting about.

But the kinds of people I was talking about, the fanatics, the white sheet crowd, won't bother to check the facts. If what he says falls in line with what they already want to believe it will reinforce those beliefs.

And no, I don't think that all Rush's followers are this kind of person. It's only a small minority, a few fanatics. But they are the most dangerous, and he knows perfectly well that they are out there, and that they listen to him religiously.

[wmrs2]

No! Absolutely not! I was talking about some of the KINDS of people who will take every word that Rush, and others like him, says as gospel.

I haven't listened to him in years, but when I did I found him to be dangerously seductive. His "facts" always seemed self-evident, and his opinions sounded logical, especially when delivered in that enthusiastic, pompous rhetoric of his. But when I checked those "facts" independently (which is something I always felt he would not want me to do) I found them to be subtly different from what he claimed. He didn't lie, precisely. It wasn't blatant. But he always added that little twist, or neglected that one word or phrase, which seemed to change the meaning of what he was ranting about.

But the kinds of people I was talking about, the fanatics, the white sheet crowd, won't bother to check the facts. If what he says falls in line with what they already want to believe it will reinforce those beliefs.

And no, I don't think that all Rush's followers are this kind of person. It's only a small minority, a few fanatics. But they are the most dangerous, and he knows perfectly well that they are out there, and that they listen to him religiously.

I am pleased with your response to my sarcasm. You are indeed a good sport. The way you feel about Rush is the same way I feel about most of the liberal commentators. I lean more to the right than the left politically, although I like to think I am broad minded. There are not too many conservative commentators but Rush is the leader. He has to take a lot of guff for his leadership.But, he does make people think and question, especially the liberals.

The liberals do not have a Rush like person. I always thought the reason they did not have a Rush person was that they did not want people to think and ask too many questions. Liberals, I think have a difficult time defending their positions on most things. They seem to borrow the Marxing concept that it is ok to say anything no matter if its the truth or not as long as it serves their greater good. To them truth is relative and to Rush it is absolute.That is the difference between the two positions. Those who study philosophy know this is true.
Thanks for being a good sport.
wmrs2